The God Who Never Turns Away: Bradley Jersak on Love, Wrath, and the Gospel in Chairs

Welcome back to The Evolutionary Revolutionary: Opti-Mystic Ways That Work—a space where mystics and misfits play in the fields of inner exploration and empowered action.

Today I’m sitting down with Dr. Bradley Jersak, Principal and Dean of Theology and Culture at St. Stephen’s University, whose theological courage has helped countless people reimagine the God revealed in Jesus Christ—both within and outside religion-as-we-know-it.

What if everything you were taught about the cross was backwards?

In this conversation, Brad shares the stunning moment when—while praying about something else entirely—he heard a voice say: “Stop telling people I was punishing my Son. That’s not what was happening.”

That arresting thought sent him back to Scripture with new eyes, eventually leading to a confrontation with his Orthodox Archbishop who looked at him and said: “You thought God couldn’t forgive without appeasing his wrath by punishing his firstborn son? I see your problem. You believe in Molech.”

In This Episode, We Explore:

The Gospel in Chairs – Brad’s viral presentation contrasting two visions of salvation: one where God turns away from us until Christ’s punishment satisfies divine wrath, and another where God never turns away at all, always toward us, always for us.

Redefining Divine Wrath – What if wrath isn’t God’s retributive punishment but the intrinsic consequences of refusing to live in God’s mercies? Brad walks us through how early Church fathers read “violent” Old Testament passages and why literalism betrays the text.

The Cross as Identification, Not Substitution – Hear the pastoral story of a woman struggling with addiction who, in prayer, saw Jesus fill a syringe and inject himself with her drugs. It’s a haunting image of Christ’s radical identification with our suffering—and his power to exchange our poverty for his abundance.

Ultimate Redemption vs. Universal Reconciliation – Brad makes his case: “I’m not ‘leaning toward’ universalism—I’m fully convinced Jesus was right when he said if he’s lifted up, he will draw all people to himself.” We wrestle with human freedom, divine love, and what happens when perfect love encounters us beyond death.

Navigating Empire as Peacemakers – With ICE raids, climate rollbacks, and the criminalization of compassion, how do we resist without mirroring the evil we oppose? Brad offers hard-won wisdom on inner transformation, prophetic minorities, and why megachurches won’t save us but small communities of love might.

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Key Quotes from our Conversation:

“God is always toward us, always for us.”

“If you think penal substitutionary atonement IS the gospel, then when that crumbles, you’ll need a new gospel—or maybe a better, more ancient, more beautiful gospel.”

“Omnipotence is not about all-powerful to do whatever God wants. It’s an adjective for the kind of love God has—all-powerful love that never gives up, never quits, never stops, never turns away.”

“We were born for this moment. Wisdom schools tend to surface at times of great political upheaval, planetary disturbances, or when human consciousness is on the threshold of surging to a whole new level.”

Episode Resources:

• St. Stephen’s University Programs and Publications:
  • MA in Theology & Culture
  • MA in Peace & Justice (in partnership with the Jim Forest Institute for Religion, Peace and Justice)
  • Centre for Reconciliation Studies with Indigenous Peoples
  • SSU Summer School! Study with Bradley Jersak, Lisa Sharon Harper, Shane Claiborne, Randy Woodley, Joash Thomas and more
  • Clarion Journal for Religion, Peace and Justice
  • The Kenarchy Journal
  • The Good on Wood Podcast hosted by Steve Schallert and Jarrod McKenna
• Books by Bradley Jersak:
  • A More Christlike God: A More Beautiful Gospel
  • Her Gates Will Never Be Shut: Hope, Hell, and the New Jerusalem
  • Out of the Embers: Faith After the Great Deconstruction
• Related Reading:
  • Sinners in the Hands of a Loving God: The Scandalous Truth of the Very Good News by Brian Zahnd
  • The Divine Dance: The Trinity and Your Transformation by Richard Rohr with Michael Morrell
  • That All Shall Be Saved: Heaven, Hell, and Universal Salvation by David Bentley Hart

About Dr. Bradley Jersak:

Bradley serves as Principal and Dean of Theology & Culture at St. Stephen’s University in New Brunswick, Canada, where they have built a remarkable graduate program integrating peace theology, contemplative practice, and grassroots peacebuilding. He’s the author of A More Christlike God: A More Beautiful Gospel, Out of the Embers: Faith After the Great Deconstruction, Her Gates Will Never Be Shut: Hope, Hell, and the New Jerusalem,  and numerous other transformative works that have helped countless people see the God revealed in Jesus afresh.

Bradley’s spiritual journey itself embodies deep ecumenism—he has spent time in Baptist, Mennonite, charismatic renewal, Orthodox, and Episcopal churches, reflecting both the humbling humanity of our continuing search for God and the multifaceted ways God finds us in the most unlikely places.

With an MA and MDiv in biblical studies, a PhD in theology from Bangor University in Wales, and postdoctoral work at Nottingham in patristic Christology, Bradley could have easily stayed comfortable in the ivory tower. Instead, he and his wife Eden spent decades planting churches and serving marginalized communities in British Columbia—a testimony to theological courage matched by pastoral presence.

These days, Bradley continues to lead and teach at St. Stephen’s, including their Jim Forest Institute for Religion, Peace & Justice. His “Gospel in Chairs” presentation has become something of a movement, spreading across continents as people encounter a vision of a God who never turns away, even when we do—vintage Bradley: deeply rooted in ancient Christian wisdom, yet utterly accessible and pastorally sensitive. You can connect to his Substack newsletter here!