Welcome, dear friends. In this dialogue we are blessed with the presence of Roger Wolsey — a minister, spiritual director, author and speaker whose journey mirrors mine in many profound ways. As children of the church, we’ve each treasured the gifts Christ brings to our lineage while venturing beyond conventional religious boundaries, exploring the rich tapestry of global spirituality, American pragmatism, counterculture, and the human potential movement. We’ve each found unique ways to synthesize these experiences, creating something deeply resonant and transformative for ourselves and many others.
In Roger’s book Discovering Fire, he doesn’t advocate for thoughtless religious syncretism, but he does recognize that our lived experiences often transcend the neat boxes of religious or spiritual categories. He draws inspiration from Methodist pioneer John Wesley and his holistic pastoral care, which led Wesley into diverse areas of advocacy—from economic aid to herbalism to early forms of electroshock therapy.
Our shared background allows us to delve deeply into conversations, often finding a rhythm that is both spontaneous and enlightening. In our interview, we cover ground like:
- Why is religion in crisis today?
- What are the benefits and drawbacks of ‘spirituality’ as a standalone pursuit? (We respond to this one from our paradoxical experiences living in the ‘spiritual’ hubs of Boulder and Asheville.)
- Why being both spiritual and religious is arguably the most countercultural way-of-being today.
- The interplay between revelation and pragmatism in religious belonging and spiritual practice
- Adaptive spiritual technologies as God’s way of helping us reconnect and thrive in a world of fresh challenges
- What are three emerging practices from the wider culture we wish Christians would embrace?
- What are three practices from the Christian tradition that we believe our spiritual-but-not-religious friends should explore?
- How can Methodist pioneer John Wesley’s approach guide us in following Jesus and embracing the full spectrum of ‘fiery grace’ available to us today?
Our discussion touches on practices including:
- Centering Prayer
- Lectio Divina
- Choir singing
- Acts of service
- Authentic Relating and its intersection with spiritual growth
- Shadow Work
- and yes, plant medicine.
Roger’s chapter on plant medicine is one of the best introductions to the topic I’ve encountered. He highlights the surprising continuities between Scripture, Christian tradition (thank you Hildegard of Bingen!), and indigenous wisdom. He presents a balanced view, considering both the promises and the perils of working with our plant siblings. He also addresses the complexities of cultural adaptation, potential pitfalls of cultural appropriation, and the consumerism of ‘Big Shamanism.’ I highly recommend you pick up Discovering Fire for this chapter alone.
Thank you for joining us. I invite you to dive into this rich conversation with open heart and mind:
To connect with Roger further, including for spiritual direction and coaching, see this helpful section on his website!
Read an excerpt of Discovering Fire here!
About the Author
Roger Wayne Wolsey is a free spirit who thinks and feels a lot about God and Jesus. He’s a progressive Christian who identifies with people who consider themselves “spiritual, but not religious.” A trumpeter, Roger grew up during the “Minneapolis Sound” era of the 1980s and ‘90s. These experiences contribute to a musical approach to his theology. Roger studied philosophy and political science, graduated magna cum laude and Phi Beta Kappa, from Macalester College in St. Paul, MN, and earned a Master of Divinity degree at the Iliff School of Theology in Denver, CO. Roger is an ordained pastor in the United Methodist Church. He has taught classes as an adjunct instructor at Graceland University in Lamoni, IA, and at the Iliff School of Theology in Denver, CO. He has served as a pastor for churches in Minnesota, Iowa and Colorado. Roger was president of the board of directors of the Boulder International Fringe Festival. He currently serves on the Board of Directors of Progressive Christianity.Org. Roger blogs for Patheos (as The Holy Kiss), Sojourners, Elephant Journal, and Huffington Post. Roger is a speaker for numerous festivals and conferences. Roger is available for speaking, retreat facilitation, and spiritual direction — check out his offerings here.
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